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My mom is 85. Lives in NY. I live in NC. She has had depression for 25 years. Never got any treatment except anti depressants. Same kind. Same dose, sometimes takes it. I have tried for years to get her to get help. Depressed for 6 mths and 2 mths comes out of it, Refuses to move when depressed. When I have small window to move her she hesitates. Her house is disgusting. I can’t visit her. I’m physically sick going in there. I have tried phone therapy. Home care visits. Dept of aging. Adult protective services. Offer to come get her. Set her up in bear apartment. Nope she just says she’s too sick, only wants me to come there and help her. I have a family. Grandchildren. She sucks the joy out of me. So negative. Re hash the past. Awful. My brothers don’t want to deal with it. This week I was planning to go get her but plan fell through, I feel awful . She has mice all over. Hoarding. I feel terrible letting her live there. But she won’t budge. I can’t drag her out, need help. Need a compassionate person to come along side me and help. My husband is great. But he knows having her close will be a drain on me

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There’s 2 separate and overlapping problems…her mental & physical health & the chaos in hoarded messy house. I believe that when house gets straightened out, she will improve. You cannot do that alone. Maybe an ultimatum from health dept. ? Call dept of aging. Hugs 🤗
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LoopyLoo Aug 1, 2024
Moving her won’t solve the problem.

It’s not about moving her to a nice or even just a clean place. Her mental illnesses will come with her. Statistics show that maybe 5% of hoarders recover. She will have the same behaviors no matter where she lives.
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What a sad situation. I can imagine how frustrating it is when someone just will not let you help them.

Your mom isn’t just depressed. She is severely mentally ill. As much as you want to fix the situation and see her in a better circumstance, it is just not possible. Not with your efforts, anyway. You have exhausted every avenue to help her. You obviously care a LOT!

But you will have to leave her in God’s hands.

If you think moving her near you will help, you’re mistaken. She would be the same person and would just re-create her situation. She won’t let you help now and she still won’t in the future no matter where she is.

She is sick. Either doesn’t understand how sick she is, or doesn’t care. I think it’s more of the latter.

If you have the faith you claim, then now is your time to put it to work. LET GO AND LET GOD.
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Carolin, I'm sorry, your moms brain is broke. You want to see your mom happy. That's what all of us want is to see are loved ones happy.

Which is why we are hear, supporting each other to help each other get through, because aging sucks, it's painful,it's mentally torcher for the giver and the sick. This is the hardest thing we will ever do. Watching are loved ones slowly loose all there facilities.

I am so sorry, stick around read are post, God do I wish it wasn't this way. For you and for me and for everyone else.
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Anxietynacy Jul 30, 2024
The last thing in the world I want to be doing is sitting and waiting for a phone call that mom fell. Or calling her in the morning praying she answers.

But ya know I've realized it is what it is. Nothing I can do to change it.
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What do you expect to change if she moves closer to you? (Heaven forbid IN with you!)
She will still have unresolved mental health issues.
She will still not want to go to therapy.
She may probably still be noncompliant with medication.
She is a hoarder where she is, she will be a hoarder when she moves.

You contact APS, mom says she needs no help.
That is all APS can do. They can not force her to move, they can not force her to accept help.
Unfortunately you wait.
And wait.
And wait some more.
Eventually something will happen that will force a change.
She may fall, become ill and a trip to the ER can then possibly facilitate change.
BUT you have to have the authority to authorize treatment, a move, a change.
do you have that authority? If not that is what you talk to m om about.
And make sure that your information is on her medical records as a person that can get and give information to medical staff.

do not put yourself in a position that this is going to mentally, emotionally, physically drain you. (And your husband)
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Carolina18 Jul 30, 2024
I would like to see her enjoy her life. Live in a beautiful apartment and I will be able to visit. She could see her grandchildren and her great grandchildren who she has not met. I thought she would get better seeing us. I feel like I’m such a neglectful daughter . Why won’t she make an attempt to get better.
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Since your reply says that your brother is POA. I would not move Mom to NC . Mom should stay close to your brother who has POA.
You have no power .
Taking this on without power is not wise.
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Carolina18 Jul 30, 2024
He would hibe me POA
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It would be tricky to move her from NY to NC without any stay at all at your house. you would need to get her fully approved and admitted to an assisted living or nursing home in NC, be approved to move in, and then move her......
so one way or another it may be tough for a move for multiple reasons.
Having her stay in NY in some capacity might be the best?
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APS has not bed. In her house. They only came by. Once she answered door and just said she doesn’t need help. They Told me adamantly we can not remove her and can not just force our way in. She has rights. All they can do is take a referral . Go by house knock on door. Follow-up in a month and 2 months
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Carolin, I'm so sorry, some people you just can't change and you can't help. I'm learning that also.

It sounds like you have gone above and beyond, to get mom help.

I think it's time to worry about your immediate family, and don't feel any guilt, this is not your fault!!

If you move mom she is just going to hoard again. Unless you can get her to go in assisted living I see no other way.

Hoarders are especially stubborn about leaving, because they won't leave there stuff they have gotten so close to, for what ever reason, that makes no sense to me.

Please be kind to yourself, don't feel guilt, you didn't cause this, infact you have done everything humanly possible to fix it.
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Carolina18 Jul 31, 2024
Thank you
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Yupp just feel so bad because I took care of my dad for 3 years . He lived with me until he passed. Hs had dementia. It was hard but got through it. She wants the same
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She already made it clear she’s not going to cooperate with a move. If she’s a true hoarder (as opposed to bad housekeeper) then she’ll never leave her hoard because it’s a mental illness and requires the guidance of a hoarding specific therapist.

Leave her alone, stop orbiting around her and just keep reporting her to APS. If she calls and asks you to come help her tell her you are helping her in the only way that accommodates your life: reporting her to APS. She’ll be angry but so what? This is a legitimate solution so stop inserting yourself. I know it feels terrible but you’ve already tried everything. Now sit it out and tag in another “rescuer”.
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You were planning to go get Mom.
Then what ? Where was she going to live ?
She already is uncooperative .
Do not move mom into your own home . Once you do that it may be impossible to get her to leave to go to an apartment or a care home , like assisted living or whatever level of care she may need later on . She may decide she likes living with you .

Even if the plan is temporary , Once you make your home her legal residence , it can be very difficult to get her out . You’ve already said her being close would be a drain on you .

Read threads under the caregiver burn out section of the many people who made the mistake of bringing a stubborn , mentally ill elder to live in their home , and can not get them to move out .

It has caused caregivers , their physical and mental health , jobs , and marriages to end .

You haven’t said that she has dementia or is incompetent to make decisions . This is why you should not take her into your home . If you wanted her to leave , She could fight to stay in your home as it would be her legal residence .

If you are not POA or guardian and/or Mom is competent to make decisions , you have no power here .

The only move I would consider is if Mom went straight to an independent living or assisted living facility . And you would need to control the amount of stuff she had .

Getting her a regular apartment would end up the same , hoarded. Then you’d be faced with her being evicted .

You say you have tried APS and the Agency of Aging without result . They must not see her in need of care for a vulnerable elder. Perhaps they see it as just a hoarder issue . You could try the Dept of Health . But if they condemn the house as not livable , Then they give her a deadline to clean it up or leave . Have you watched the show Hoarder’s ? What will you do if they say she has to get out, and she won’t ?

This is an impossible situation which is why your brothers stay away .

Unless your mother is willing to go to a doctor to be tested for dementia , My suggestion is to wait until something happens to force a change . Wait until Mom ends up in the hospital and ask to have her tested for dementia , and competence . They will tell you to do it as an outpatient . You tell them she refuses to go for testing as an outpatient , and tell them her living conditions . Hopefully they will then test her .

If she is deemed not competent or not safe to live alone , you have the social worker at the hospital help with placement . You tell them there is no one to take care of her , and she can’t live with you . You tell them you work ( even if you don’t ) .
They will try to say it’s your responsibility to deal with it but it’s not if you are not guardian , or POA . They will say homecare will come , it won’t be enough .
If they say she can not be alone then you say it’s an unsafe discharge to send her home and don’t pick her up from the hospital .

The social workers at the hospitals are told to get people discharged and have the families figure it out . Don’t go along with that .

In the mean time I would keep pushing APS , Dept of Aging to keep checking . Maybe one of them that goes will
decide they need to pull her out of her home and place her in a facility .

I’m sorry you have to watch this .
You can’t drag her out yourself .
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Carolina18 Jul 30, 2024
Thank you. She knows she can not live with me. Not an option, Not even for a few days. She will never leave. I don’t have POA. My brother does. He lives the closest. He just wants to go up once a month get groceries and get out. My other brother just waiting for me to do something.
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If APS has done nothing, then go to the police. Tell them what's going on and ask if they will make a wellness check on your mother. They will. The police will put the fire under APS to get her out of there.

Also, you can complain to the city. If the house is as bad as you say, it will be condemned and the law will force her out, or force her to work with professional cleaners and contractors to get it up to standard.

Whatever you do, don't move her in with you because she will destroy your life, your home, and your marriage.

Get your brothers on board with this. Ask them to help with making these calls and talking to the right people.

You can't clean her house if she is a hoarder and the place is falling apart. You need professionals to do this. Get the city involved because your mother like so many seniors won't "allow" anything to get done unless it's on their terms and done by whom they choose.

She can't be "allowed" to decide anymore and you have to take that choice away from her by calling in the city. Then she will be forced to accept the help she needs in the house or to be moved into an AL where she can be looked after and cared for.
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Carolina18 Jul 30, 2024
Yes well ness check. I always tell her if she doesn’t answer phone I’m calling. I have a secret key so they won’t have to break lock
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APS has done nothing to remove her from rodent infested conditions? Yet you think you can swoop in and save her? She'll ruin your life, my friend. Mental illness of this caliber is too difficult for you to manage.

Try calling the Dept of Health for advice and see what they say. They may condemn the house which would force her to move. But again, you'll be opening a Pandoras Box you won't be able to close back up again. Be forewarned.

Good luck to you.
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Carolina18 Jul 31, 2024
Thank you
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