An American in Canada

Great question! I have often wondered about this too. Did you see on the debate last night that Denmark is considered to be the ‘happiest’ place to live because of their quality of life?

In general landed immigrants are eligible for healthcare but there may be a waiting period, in my province (Ontario) it is 3 months. You also have to actually live in your province for half the year to maintain eligibility, that's why snowbirds fly home in the summer.
Doctor shortages continue to be a problem, finding a doctor that is accepting new patients can be difficult in some communities.
I don't think there is any noticeable anti American bias.
Although at first glance we are culturally very similar to our American cousins don't make the mistake of thinking there aren't fundamental differences between us.
Remember our population is 1/10 of America's, there is much less density and there are only a dozen cities in the entire country with populations over 500,000.
Cost of Living - just like in the USA that varies, affordable housing can be difficult to find in urban centres, especially Toronto and Vancouver.

CWillie, thanks for the information.   It's much more adaptable than I thought; I was thinking in terms of years, if one could qualify at all.

NeedHelp, I couldn't tolerate the debate.  I've reached and surpassed my quota for old white chauvinist men, rich men, empty platitudes and promises w/o any substantive detail, yelling and hollering, and all that friction, not to mention what comes from the other side.

That's why I'm considering leaving if certain events happen in November.

I've always wanted to retire in France, but couldn't afford it now (couldn't even afford the transportation!) but Montreal is enticing as well, and I'd still be on the same continent and could speak English until my French is tolerable.

GA,

Unfortunately, what you described has become typical in politics. I am sick of it too. I wouldn’t mind leaving either.

I would like to think this would be one of the few refuges we have from politics. Can we not keep politics out of this discussion?

GA,

Wherever you decide to live for whatever reasons that you have, I hope it all works out and that you are happy with your choice. Let us know what you decide.

I can understand having your heart set on France. France would be lovely. Finances does influence where we live though.

Looks like you know the general area in Canada that you would like to be and have to figure out the details. Best of luck to you.

Yes, GardenArtist, CWillie is correct. Vancouver is very expensive. I live in a suburb of Vancouver. We paid almost half a mil for a very small condo that isn't even in the heart of the city. Rental properties are getting extremely hard to come by here. Also as Willie said, finding a good family doctor is difficult as well.

Having said all that I'd still rather live here than live anywhere that had the big yellow haired dufous as a President. Plus you would be very welcomed here Garden.😁

Gershun,

Too funny! Many people feel that way! Hey, thanks for the laugh.

So, is Vancouver your favorite spot? What about Montreal as GA mentioned?

Needhelp, I've never lived in another place. I was born in Toronto but we moved here when I was four so I have no recollection of it.

Vancouver is scenically beautiful and people are nice. Very laid back vibe but not a lot of culture to be honest whereas what I've heard about Montreal is they have a lot of culture. The Quebecois party has been wanting to separate from Canada for many years but they will never have a majority government in my opinion so it probably will never happen.

Alberta has a lot of cowboys if you like that sort of thing.🤔

We were fortunate to have a stop in Vancouver while on an Alaskan Cruise and I thought it was a beautiful city! I would love to go there for a vacation. And what really sticks out in my mind is that the street people there blended in with everyone else. Here in California and the US in general, most don’t blend in. So while we were walking down a busy street with lots of shopping, I was noticing some people sitting down with dogs or walking by with dogs and at one point we are walking along and my husband starts talking to a woman walking by with her dog. I thought he must have been asking about her dog or something.....but no....she was begging for money! LOL. I never would have guessed because she was clean and didn’t have the rough appearance of an addict. Anyway he had some Canadian coins we wouldn’t be using so he gave them to her. The part of Vancouver we were in, it was really similar to Monterey, same casual vibe but the street folks were cleaner and friendlier. Actually on that entire trip, everyone in Alaska and Canada was so friendly. Really made me realize what assholes we Americans are :P

Gershun,

Thanks for the info. It’s always interesting to speak to others about their residence.

Hahaha, cowboys? Not exactly my cup of tea...no offense to the cowboys

Here in BC Immigrants are eligible for MSP (Medical Services Plan) coverage after 3 months. I believe there is an monthly fee for immigrants for a period of time. At least there is for International Students. It can be hard to find a GP (General Practitioner), they are the gate keeper for accessing healthcare.

We do not have Medicare/Medicaid. Here in BC it costs a minimum of $1500 per month for a publicly funded bed in a nursing home. We do have long wait lists to get into the existing nursing homes. The minimum is based on the federal pensions available to lower income Canadians. Unless you work in Canada, you will not have access to these pensions, at then you would only have a very small CPP.

Taxes will be an issue, you will need to file in both Canada and the US. This does not mean you will be taxed twice. It will get more expensive and you will need to have a Tax Accountant prepare your taxes and they can cost upwards of $300.

Housing costs are incredibly high in some regions and very reasonable in other areas. If you are thinking of buying check out realtor.ca. You can search by area and price. If you know what area you are interested in you can google local rental vacancies too. Check out local FB Neighbourhood watch pages to get an idea of local crime rates and areas to avoid.

Electricity costs in Ontario are higher than here in BC, as people are charged for both usage and transmission. I pay $81 per month. I have an oil furnace and I do not keep my house warm, only 65 degrees and I put on a sweater. I pay between $2000 - 3000 per year for furnace oil depending on how cold the winter has been.

In BC AC is rare except in newer houses with heat pumps, or houses where the furnace has been replaced with a heat pump. Up until recently it has rarely been needed.

Groceries will cost more. You can google grocery flyers in the communities you are interested in to get an idea of sale prices. Milk, cheese and meat are all more expensive.

Car insurance rates may well be higher here. In BC you have to convert your driver's license to a BC one within 90 days of arriving in the province. If you do not, you have to go through the graduated licensing program.

Will you be welcome? It is unlikely you would wear a MAGA hat here, that would not be welcome at all. Canadians are quietly patriotic, we do not hang flags at our homes, businesses, vehicles etc. We do not wear our flag, except on Canada Day, July 1st. As long as you do not try to tell us that X, Y or Zed is better in the states you will fit in fine. Yes, I said Zed, not Zee.

You will have to check with an immigration lawyer about the legalities of moving here.

Oh I should add, at least in BC the smoking of cigarettes is frowned upon, but the smoking of Marijuana is far more acceptable. Both are legal in Canada.

Gershun,

Locals get used to the various cultures in the Lower Mainland.

Metro Vancouver has the largest Chinatown in North America x2. The original Chinatown downtown and Richmond. The food in Richmond is considered to be the best Chinese food outside of China.

The Indo Canadian communities in Richmond and Surrey bring incredible diversity to the region. Diwali is an incredible festival.

Commercial Drive and Hastings in Burnaby for Italian.

Vancouver has one of the largest Pride Festivals in Canada.

The Festival of Lights in English Bay.

There is lots to do if you look.

Tothill, I get what you are saying. To be honest I've gone for Chinese food in Richmond. Wasn't impressed. The Dhawali festival is a joke in my opinion. I guess it's fun if watching a bunch of grim faced East Indian people in a parade is fun to you. I'm married to an East Indian man so this isn't a racist comment. Just a personal observation. He doesn't even enjoy Dhawali. Chinatown is okay I guess but so close to the downtown Eastside you should be careful. The summer fireworks? Been there, done that.

Sorry, this is my city and I like it but not impressed with it's culture.

Tothill,

Love hearing all of your info on your area. So interesting to hear about places around the globe.

I would love to visit Canada. I couldn’t move there because I simply couldn’t handle the cold weather. What are the warmest months to visit? Or best time in general to visit?

Just for fun, I looked up the best places in the world with the best climate. Number one place was Canary Islands.

GA,
Have you seen the very funny videos of a Canadian (wearing a bulky brown sweater), building a block wall on the border between Canada and the USA.?

And yes, he says while Canadians welcome the flood of immigrants, they are going to come to us. A rescue, and all of Canada will be running for president of the U.S.

So polite, so funny. I did check their immigration laws a bit, and a person must be self-supporting to become a citizen.

So, when are we all going to Canada?

Send, you are welcome here. All except Trump that is. He can stay there and rot for all I care.🤗

Wow!  I'm overwhelmed at the valuable information being provided.  I honestly hadn't even thought of some of the issues being raised, and they're valid, and critical.   The cost of utilities, housing, groceries...they weren't even on my mind.

I have a lot to think about, and now more questions to ask.

Gershun, I understand your position.   I'm P'M'ing you with some additions to your "description" of a certain individual.  

Tothill, very helpful insights which encouraged me to think a lot about any decision.

As to medical treatment, am I correct in understanding that I couldn't see a neurologist, cardiac or any other medical doctor w/o first being referred by a GP?   What do people do in the interim if they need treatemtn?

I'm wondering also about coverage, if there's no comparable Medicare.   Is every citizen covered (including immigrants) after a certain time?  There are no multiple choices of medical insurance coverage?

What happens in emergencies?   Can anyone avail themselves of emergency treatment if necessary?

Taxes...hadn't even thought of that.   And it's an important issue.

I have a lot of thinking, and rationalizing to do, but I'll be back, probably with more questions!

It wasn't until I started reading on this forum and others that I really began to get a feel for the complexities of American style healthcare. Once you have status and are eligible for coverage in Canada you really don't ever have to think about what to do when you are ill; there are no deductibles, no co-pays, you just go to the doctor, urgent care, ER - wherever it is appropriate. There is much less division of care here, your GP is expected to handle everything and specialists are there to provide care that is more complex - for example from what I understand most women in the USA go to a gynecologist for routine women's health, here you usually only are referred to one when there are problems.

A caveat - administering medicare is a provincial responsibility so there are regional differences. And in many ways Quebec is another country altogether.

Should I stay,
Or should I go?

I know of someone who is going to need a sanctuary country. Lol.

CWillie and Gershun,

Do GPs have to have extra training?   It sounds as if they're performing much broader functions than here, in my experience.    I've been to a few, taken Dad to more than a few, and found shortcomings in each.   One fiddled around trying to solve a problem, wasted time and eventually said he couldn't solve the issue and we needed to see a specialist.  In the meantime, a problem remained unresolved.

Another idiot, despite being advised Dad was taking Warfarin, prescribed a med for what he misdiagnosed in the first place.  The med was contraindicated with Warfarin; he never warned us of the need for increased monitoring, , and Dad ended up hemorrhaging and in the hospital.   That was really a close call, and I chided myself for not thinking to ask about contraindications, accepting that since I gave him a list of meds that he would read it.  

I've had experiences like that with literally every GP, and grew to view them in contempt.   

I did eventually find a good one, recommended by a top notch podiatrist.


We do have literally a mess of insurance carriers, individual qualifications (including addressing injuries) that are difficult to navigate.    A cousin had a difficult time finding coverage b/c of repeated, pre-existing skin cancer.  

Even the issue of pre-existing conditions raises issues.   Should a pre-existing condition like  cancer be considered on the same level as those arising from something like drug or alcohol abuse?  (I'm not saying they are; I don't know and am just offering a query).

There are so many options that it's difficult to navigate them; it's like being in a canoe or boat approaching multiple channels - which one to take?    I don't know how our system became so complex, but there are vested interests which benefit from it.   

It's interesting how something so basic can be so different in an alleged first-world country, which America is (now, at least).


Tothill, you raised some very pertinent points as well.    I hadn't even thought of expenses such as heat.   You wrote of having an oil furnace.   Most in my area have either gas or electric, so we have bills for both.   It's impossible to separate the electrical cost of heating from the cost of appliances though, so I can only judge by the cost of gas, which during the summer is about $10 - 15 but in the winter shoots up to around $100/monthly, although that would be lower if I had the funds to re-insulate the entire house.

Housing costs:  I definitely will do some online research.   I wouldn't mind living outside a city, and just being close enough for activities.   Montreal calls to me probably b/c of its French influence and some of the magnificent buildings I've seen in articles or on tv specials.

One aspect of American architecture I deplore are the slick, modern homes with little or "canned" personalization.  Victorians and log homes appeal to me.   I love the detail of Victorian architecture, or similarly decorative buildings such as I've seen in travelogues of Montreal.

I think in America the tech trend is now toward basic structures w/o lovely amenities,  and I think it reflects in other aspects of life as well.

So much to think about....

Send, well, we know that sanctuary cities are viewed differently, absolutely necessary for some of us who think that we should help disadvantaged people of other nations, and to avoid political strife, I'll leave it at that, other than to opine that we're literally all immigrants, except perhaps for Native Americans, but I'm not current on American history before that period and believe there were others here before they were.

It should be noted though that my maternal family fled tyranny and genocide; one relative disappeared and was never heard from after seeking sanctuary outside of his native country.

Had America not been open to immigrants at that time, I might not be here today.   So I'm an ADAMANT supporter of sanctuary cities and accepting those in need of solace, comfort, food and sanctuary.

Good morning, GA. From my perspective, it is not a matter of whether Americans are wanted or not wanted - it depends on the person. I think we are pretty accepting of other cultures.

You mention establishing a new medical team. I have observed that in the US people go to many more specialists than we do here. I am 82 and have seen 2 types of specialists - obgyns for having some of my children, though that was not inevitable, and about 10 years ago an infectious disease specialist for a gut infection and I had to push my GP for that, For the most part people are dealt with by their GPs (general practitioners). I think the health care system here is better than in the US, and certainly more affordable. I read recently that in the US 4x the amount is spent on health care than is spent in Canada. Mother was in a state of the art, single room, NH for the last part of her life for less than $25,000 a year. Not that that is typical, but it is possible.

Montreal is a very interesting city. I lived there for a few years when I was a young adult. I can't speak to how it is now, but there were cultural sensitivities when I was there. I was born 60 miles west of Montreal in a small town and grew up there till me teens. The arts abound in that city - music, theatre, galleries and also great restaurants. I miss them all.

However, I would be careful about moving anywhere, and spend some in a place before making a permanent move. I don't know where you are in the US or what you are used to, but there are several places in Canada with mild climates. Mother lived in Windsor (Southern Ontario) for years and liked it. The climate is good there. Parts of BC, already mentioned in posts, are often chosen by seniors and I certainly understand why. There are lovely spots on the mainland and on Vancouver Island. I have friend on the island who loves it there. It is a wonderful place for gardening as is Southern Ontario. In Montreal, BTW, you can expect ice storms and blizzards in the winter and lots of snow. In Alberta, where I am, the climate is lovely in the summer, but there is little fall and spring, and too much winter in many places.

Cost of living varies to some extent with location and at present the US dollar works well to your advantage.

I lived in Britain for about 7 years when I was young (teen to early 20s). The experience of living in a different country than the one of my birth was enriching. As cw mentioned, we are different to Americans and I like the difference. We are one of the top 10 happiest nations in the world and one of the best countries to live in according to https://www.worldatlas.com/articles/the-best-countries-to-live-in-the-world.html. I think that is something to be proud of.

Please continue to share your thoughts and plans for your future. I wish you well in your pursuit for a better life.

ETA
Having read the posts added since I started mine, I would heed cw's comment "And in many ways Quebec is another country altogether." I agree, Last time (many years ago) I drove the highway between Montreal and Ottawa you could tell where the border between Quebec and Ontario was with your eyes closed, as there were no more potholes in the road on the Ontario side.
was
Re GPs I don't know if their training is better though I do know that that training of nurses here leaves our nurses in an advantageous position for employment in the states. But considering that the proof of the pudding is in the eating, we do seem to survive with our GPs pretty well.

https://www.conferenceboard.ca/hcp/Details/Health/life-expectancy.aspx?AspxAutoDetectCookieSupport=1
"Canada maintains its “B” grade and 6th-place ranking among 17 peer countries. The gap in life expectancy between Canada and the U.S. continues to widen; Canadians now live three years longer than Americans. Life expectancy is a good indicator of overall health in a country. "

Golden, thanks for the insightful and helpful information.  I'm really pleased with  all the great responses I've gotten.  

I think it behooves me to do much more investigation, especially into the various areas.   While Montreal appeals to me because of the French culture, the ice storms, blizzards and lots of snow do not!

I think perhaps a smaller area, more rural and centrally located but still close to the big cities might be a better option.  

I haven't been to Windsor in years; the most recent trips were over a decade ago to the London airport for one of the best air shows I've experienced.  One aspect that impressed me was the cleanliness of the airport and the highways - not littered with garbage or junk or other things thrown out of windows.  

I'm still in a bit of shock at the medical system differences.   When my father was alive, we had a neurologist, podiatrist, cardiologist, urologist, dentist, infectious disease on occasion,  and geriatrician...I think.  In addition, a coumadin clinic was involved.   

I may have forgotten others.   In some ways it was good, in other ways it was not.   This is a very different concept so it takes some thought to  understand and accept it.  

I am in absolute shock over the reasonable cost of nursing home care.   Around 2018 I researched assisted living facilities in the event I could convince Dad to leave his own home (he wouldn't).   I don't recall for sure but the one that was most acceptable was either $6K or $7K monthly.  

It's no wonder that people need to seek Medicaid help with those kinds of prices.

I'm in SE Michigan, in the Metro area, which frequently is incorrectly referred to as Metro Detroit, with the inference that we're literally satellite suburbs of Detroit which is not the case except in the view of some Detroiters.   The suburbs are each entirely different, with wealthier ones on the West side.  

Some are ethnically populated; mine was Jewish and Orthodox after WWII; suburbs to the west are Jewish as well but more wealthy.  Further west suburbs are more Asian b/c the well run suburbs attract white collar employees of auto companies.   NW are the lakes areas, with multiple private and some public lakes throughout the area.  The county is quite diverse.  

Cities bordering the county in which Detroit is located are often referred to as ring cities.  Some want to be considered suburbs of Detroit; others don't, as Detroit doesn't have a positive image, something it's been battling for decades.  
I wouldn't want to live in a similar environment again. 

There are clusters of ethnicity as well, but there haven't been the problems that occur elsewhere.   At least we haven't as yet had any mass shootings that I know of!

There are so many factors I hadn't considered.   I think first I need to acquaint myself more with the different areas, and then with the different cultures.  

I hope I would be wanted... I could promise lots of produce from my garden, free quilts and some good home made bread if I was accepted!  Being able to garden freely would be just as important as medical support. 

The advice of everyone here is sincerely appreciated; I have so much more to think about.    Thank you all!

Golden,

As usual, I thoroughly enjoyed reading your posts. Wonderful detailed description of Canada. Now I really want to visit!

GA,

What a lovely neighbor you would be! Produce and a handmade quilt! Oh my gosh! I would love living next door to you!!!

I had a neighbor who loved baking bread. I love cooking but I have only baked bread once! Baking homemade bread is a true labor of love.

When my neighbor would send over her homemade bread I felt like I was receiving gold! Just being inside her home and inhaling her fabulous bread baking made me happy!

I would give her some of my homemade soup because she loved soup but hated cooking. Her thing was baking.

We were a good match as neighbors. She was much older and died several years back. I just loved her. She was so kind to me and she adored my children.

She had married when she was young. He mistreated her and she left him. She stayed married for three weeks! Hahaha. She was a character!

She said that she saved herself a lifetime of hell by not sticking around for more abuse from her husband. She was unusual for a woman of her generation. I truly loved her. I think of her often.

I have a feeling your neighbors would fall in love with you.

GA, this is a fun thread!

Okay, I have to bring this up. I have been to Vermont. I have not been to Canada. I would love to though.

I enjoyed visiting New England and of course, loved the maple syrup. My daughters grew up eating maple syrup from Vermont.

My husband makes the very best breakfast and the girls adored his pancakes on Saturday mornings. He only served pure maple syrup, never imitation syrup.

Anyway, my oldest daughter went to Canada and brought back some maple syrup for us. Yummy! Have any of the Canadians on this forum tried Vermont syrup? Do you prefer your syrup? I like both, no preference, really.

NHWM,

Where I live on Vancouver Island we have Broad Leaf Maple trees. Google them to see how huge they grow. In the past 15 years or so people have been tapping them. The syrup can be much darker than the syrup from Sugar Maples, but is delicious too.

We have some of the mildest weather in Canada here. It can get hot where I live in the summer but it is not humid or muggy. Winters are wet, similar to Seattle, but perhaps a bit warmer, here in the Cowichan Valley.

Tothill,

Really interesting trees in your area. I just googled it. Says that your trees produce twice the amount of calcium and magnesium over the sugar maples elsewhere. Looks like the syrup is a bit different as well, unique flavor and delicious.