I so very much appreciate everyone on this site. You have never met me but I feel accepted and cared about.
Thank you for the answers, ideas, criticisms, knowledge, and even some love.
Thank you, all.
I know; in my head; that I need to find a way to NOT strive, live, wait or hope to obtain some love from my mother. Yet, my heart aches when I confront the reality of my life as her daughter.
Knowing that my own Narcissist mother is nearing the end of her life, makes me panic. I panic because I feel that my time to get her love is finite.
I know I sound very selfish. I try hard to NOT make anything about me. I just want her love but I know that I will probably never get it.
Why is it so hard for me to disconnect?
Why can't I be stronger?
I am starting (thanks to this group) to:
*stand a little firmer
*say 'no' a few times to my mother
*occasionally hang up the phone when repeatedly insulted
*state that I feel we (mother and me) could get along better
* not go to her home as often or spend weeks/months at her home
This forum is so much more than I thought it could ever be.
Thank you to all of you.
I appreciate every response, every idea, every wonderful criticism,
every encouragement and everyone! I hope I will give back to this forum; at least; as much as I have been given.
Bevel2
This conversation will be difficult for you, I know it would be for me. Rather than trying to remember what you want to say, write it down and just read it if you have to. Along with that, I still think you need some counseling.
Google ‘psychodrama’, and see if there is a group or a practitioner you can access. The way it works is that you write an oral ‘script’ by asking the colleague your question, then swap places so colleague asks your question, and you ‘script’ the loving response you want. Then swap places back and forward to continue a dialogue.
You can then do it again, change your question, change to a not-so-loving response, and say your reaction to that. Again, and you can yell and scream, and ‘script’ how your mother would reply to that.
When it works, it is quite cathartic. It stops the unanswered questions going round and round in your head, because you have said it all out loud. I’ve taken part in a group where at the end of a participant’s ‘drama’ with his father, we found out that his father was dead. He still had his chance to say the things that had never been said before.
If you can’t find a way to deal with this, psychodrama might be worth a try. It’s actually quite enjoyable, and it’s quick and cheap, compared with therapy!
We mourn the loss of what should have been., or could have been in our lives. We grieve. Falling apart at your father’s funeral was a valid and normal grieving experience. We are designed to grieve. It isn’t healthy to suppress grief. There are normal stages of grief that we feel.
You were not an idiot. People should not have stared at you, making you feel uncomfortable. No matter what the circumstances, even in the most loving relationships, funerals are emotional experiences. In hard times, unexpected feelings can surface and hit us out of the blue, like a ton of bricks. Are we ever fully prepared for the many emotions that we feel when death of a family member occurs.
Sometimes, death doesn’t even seem real. It can take awhile to sink in. I hope you have found peace in your life. You deserve it. I am so sorry that you went through these hard times with your dad.
You don’t mention the relationship that you had with your father. You don’t have to volunteer any personal information. I don’t wish to pry into any personal areas that are none of my business. Nor would I want to push you to speak about something that you are uncomfortable speaking about.
It’s bad enough having one mentally ill parent and incredibly sad when both parents harm a child. Mental harm is just as damaging as physical harm. Some children experience both.
I hope that you did receive love from your father. We have had posters who were very close with their dad but the relationship was somewhat difficult due to their mom’s interference.
I find it very disturbing that a narc parent can wreck havoc in the relationship that the children have with their parent who is supportive and has loving behavior towards them.
My father was a genius, creative, inventive, so smart..... but didn't show a lot of emotion. He did love me and my sister. In his way, he tried to show love but it was always restrained.
My mother and father divorced when I was 13.
At that time, my mother told me that I was the only reason that they are "forced" to stay together. My mother was very, very physically and emotionally abusive to my father; in front of me {but not my sister-golden child].
So, at 12 yrs. old: I separately approached each of them to tell them that I did not need them to stay together, that I would actually prefer to them to be apart & live without the fights, that I understood all the reasons, repercussions, etc., etc., etc.
Time goes by...… My father starts showing a lot of signs of dementia. So, I have him move in with me and I take care of him. He is diagnosed with Alzheimer's and he lives with me and my 3 boys for 7 years: until the very last year where he must be in a care facility. I made a lot of mistakes caring for my father. I regret those mistakes: even now.
My boys helped me: but they are fairly young. Stupidly, I have a boyfriend move in to help me: that did not go well: and my son's have never really forgiven me - different story.
I loved my father and he loved me and my sister. I cared for him; when he needed it but I made so many mistakes.
When my mother started to get signs of dementia {very different from my father's Alzheimer's}: I stepped up to care for her. However, she is so cruel, vindictive, mean, spiteful and a Narcissist - nothing like my father.
I don't have the experience to fall on from caring for my father because she is so very different.
I am only knowledgeable in what mistakes to NOT make.
So, that is my father. There is obviously, so much more: but no need to go into.
-Bevel
That is Never a reflection on you, in truth you are lovable. Honestly she is broken and some people are not emotional and are detached from emotion.
Something that helped me once was that "once you learn to accept the apology that was never given" you can move on.
Yes you desire to see love and you have every right to want it. But know that we can not make anyone do anything. I pray you find others who show you how loved you are.
I once told my mother how she was so mean to me growing up and she said "your grandmother told me to be" (my grandmother was loving to me) so honestly my mother will never "get it" she has no clue how she stripped my self esteem. But i have others who love me so i treasure that.
We hear on media that portrays a mother's love is the best love. Well a lot of us never had that and so we have to move onto our other positives. It would definitely help to find a counselor or woman's group and find out how common this is. My best to you.
You have the history of the relationship between the two of you. Evidently, it's been a one way street - you have sought your mother's approval, as a demonstration of love, and she has withheld it. Well, perhaps she doesn't have it to give, or at least not in any recognisable form. That is certainly not your fault, but *perhaps it isn't hers either.* And you have loved her anyway. Your shared history still includes the tenderness and care you have shown her all your life. Value those more highly.
You will also have noticed that the boundaries you've begun to introduce do not in any way lessen how much you love and care for this lady, and do not harm her material wellbeing. Instead, they have allowed you to respect yourself *as well* and to take better care of yourself *as well.*
I wonder if the sense of panic you're currently feeling is some of those old bonds pulling at you harder as you begin to get free. Try again! Try harder! This is your last chance! - they're saying to you. Don't fall for it. They're the same fears in a slightly different disguise and with a more piercing tone of voice, and the more they pull the more it shows you're winning.
My story is complicated by a narcissistic sibling, so the story is ongoing.
Best wishes to you.
Your mom may never offer you love in a way you can appreciate. Dr. Chapman says there are 5 love languages:
quality time (being together and doing things together),
words of affirmation (saying, writing things that encourage you or validate a loving relationship),
service (doing things for the other person),
physical touch (hugs, kisses, pats on back...), and
gifts (large and small tokens of affection). Consider if your mother ever offers anything to you along the lines of one or more of these "languages". If so, that "language(s)" are probably her love language. Use those to express love to her. Also, let her know which way you prefer to receive love. My bet is that you are a words of affirmation person. She may not know how to "love" you the way you prefer, but I pray she is expressing appreciation in her own way.
Since your mom is a self-lover, she may not realize that she needs to express love to you as well as receive it. If expressing love to her in her language does not result in reciprocal love in a few weeks, then she may be unable to express love. Consider it a disability like blindness, deafness, paralysis... If she is disabled, she can't do something that doesn't work.
If you come to realize your mom can't express love, please consider 2 suggestions. Most importantly, work with a counsellor to "grieve" this loss of maternal love and get to a place of peace. Next, get your need for love and affirmation filled by friends and other family members. I am fairly sure another older woman would willingly and joyfully want to fill your need for maternal love. I am a Christian and have found many women in churches who have "mothered" me as well as men and women who have "sistered", "brothered," and "fathered". I have enjoyed by "aunt" and "grandma" to younger folks. Maybe start looking for loving friends in a local church.
So even though I miss her snd want her in my life in every way possible …. I have been stress free and like someone’s answer above … she has done me a favor by cutting me and her family off and no longer dealing with her abuse. Parents are not always the narcissists …. Adult children can fit that title as well. My daughter has never owned up to her faults and continues to blame her family for everything wrong in her life.
This has been very hard for me but at the same time I find myself feeling more at peace and less stressed by her attacks.
I know this is long snd I’m sorry …
It’s terribly sad when there is dysfunction in families. No one has a perfect family but some suffer more than others. If you are not how your daughter describes you, then live your life with a clear conscience. Be at peace.
We can’t pick our family but we can choose our friends. Some friends become our family, don’t they?
Wishing you all the best.
Sadly, not all moms show motherly love.
Yet, my mother in law was one of the kindest women who ever walked this earth! She always said that she learned what NOT to do from them. She told me when I married her son, “You are my daughter now, I will never treat you like I was treated by my mother and mother in law.” She always treated me lovingly. I loved her very much.
nothing will change if old, possibly skewed memories control your future relationship. And narcissism is thrown around to lightly so adult kids an say the best way to deal with it is not see or talk to them.
this is hurtful and no method to deal with aging parents.
Bevel, please ignore this nonsense, you know what your mom is.
At some point I had to let go of the idea that something was going to change and that my past was going to be reconciled somehow. I focus my attention on having a great future and put my energy into people that will return my love for them.
This is not about you. You can be and are the loving and kind person she never could be. The other day I was making meatballs for my family for our “Saturday Spaghetti” get together and in my head I was infusing the meatballs with loving words. I know this sounds silly. But I also know these are the memories I will purposely be creating for my own children and grandchildren rather than the horror stories that I recall. My advice is to not waste one more minute on hoping you will get your mother’s approval and start making great memories for those around you or even just yourself.
I don’t want to sound like this is an easy journey. That overnight you wake up and start making magical meatballs. It’s painful. I don’t want to spew toxic positivity! It took therapy and a lot of tears and support from friends and family. And I’m still not over the abuse but I’m much better. One day I realized that my own time on earth is limited. Stop searching for bread at the hardware store. All my love to you!
After about 40 years I made the decision to exclude her from my life for a good ten years. After that I had extremely limited contact with her until she died a few months ago. Unfortunate and terribly sad for all concerned. We cannot make people love us, no matter who they are, and we are wise not to try. It is what it is.
I’ve spent a lot of time in therapy and recommend you try it too for yourself. Other things that have helped tremendously are meditations (calm.com), yoga, Buddhism, reading and study, support from my NAMI chapter. I recommend a book called “Radical Acceptance” by Tara Brach. You cannot change anyone, only yourself.
One of the things you describe are boundaries. I’ve had a difficult time with boundaries my entire life. I’m better about it now, but have to be conscious of it as people will treat you as you have allowed them to treat you. Say no, maybe to small things at first. Walk away, don’t answer your phone or emails, do what you need to do to establish some boundaries. It’s ok really! You don’t have to be everything to everyone.
Please come back and let us know how YOU are, you need to start taking care of YOU!
It's hard for you, me, and anyone else to disconnect from parents like ours because we've had a lifetime of their abusive conditioning literally starting on day one. So it's tough for people like us to not get lost in a F.O.G. (Fear-Obligation-Guilt) when our selfish, narcissistic, and often downright abusive parents get elderly and needy. Their conditioning of us our entire life, makes us afraid to say no and stand up for ourselves. That somehow if we say no to some absurd request or don't suffer their bullying and insults in silence that this erases an entire lifetime of trying our best and striving for them to love and appreciate us. It doesn't.
I learned this some time ago. My mother who is dependent on me knows that I'm not getting "cancelled" by anyone because I refuse to live my life based on her needs and wants. I do what she needs, but I do it on my terms not hers. In her old age she wants me to be a loving, empathetic caregiver who can't do enough for her. She also knows she will never get that from me. A person can't give what they don't have.
If you're meeting mother's needs (not wants) in her old age, then you are a better person than she is. Let that be some small comfort to you. And if you say no, or hang up on her when she's getting mean, or don't go running to her house every minute that does not cancel all the years you've done for her.
I am so sorry that you haven’t received the love that you needed and deserve.
A very good friend of mine always has gatherings at her home for her ‘real’ family. That what she calls us, her friends that she has retained a friendship with for more than 20 years. A very long time ago she went to a therapist who told her to replace her family that hurt her, and form a new family of people who respected her and appreciated her. That’s exactly what she did to fill her void and she never looked back.
Sometimes, she is sad. She mourned the loss of not having a loving mom and sisters, quite some time ago, but there are days that she feels pain when she sees others who have meaningful relationships with their families. She never knew her dad.
I am not suggesting that you abandon your mom. That is not my place to do. All I am saying, is to protect your heart.
It makes us wonder, ‘Why us?’ when these things happen in our lives. I am glad that you found this forum, because many people here have been in your shoes. They can add their own perspective and shed some light on how to cope.
I hope that you don’t believe any lies that your mom may have told you. That’s awful. Seek validation from those who really care for you.
Wishing you peace. Share your thoughts. We care.
Narcissistic personality disorder - Symptoms and causes - Mayo Clinic
Symptoms
Signs and symptoms of narcissistic personality disorder and the severity of symptoms vary. People with the disorder can:
Have an exaggerated sense of self-importance
Have a sense of entitlement and require constant, excessive admiration
Expect to be recognized as superior even without achievements that warrant it
Exaggerate achievements and talents
Be preoccupied with fantasies about success, power, brilliance, beauty or the perfect mate
Believe they are superior and can only associate with equally special people
Monopolize conversations and belittle or look down on people they perceive as inferior
Expect special favors and unquestioning compliance with their expectations
Take advantage of others to get what they want
Have an inability or unwillingness to recognize the needs and feelings of others
Be envious of others and believe others envy them
Behave in an arrogant or haughty manner, coming across as conceited, boastful and pretentious
Insist on having the best of everything — for instance, the best car or office
At the same time, people with narcissistic personality disorder have trouble handling anything they perceive as criticism, and they can:
Become impatient or angry when they don't receive special treatment
Have significant interpersonal problems and easily feel slighted
React with rage or contempt and try to belittle the other person to make themselves appear superior
Have difficulty regulating emotions and behavior
Experience major problems dealing with stress and adapting to change
Feel depressed and moody because they fall short of perfection
Have secret feelings of insecurity, shame, vulnerability and humiliation
Most of all, be kind to yourself and allow yourself to grieve what you've never received, and find hope in the future.