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It is not illegal to try to collect a bill from anyone. No doubt, it is a collection agency or even a scam. Do not tell them anything other that to stop the harassment or you will report them to the Federal Communications Corporation. Hopefully you did not sign papers as anything other than POA on mom's behalf when she was admitted.
I'd suggest checking with a lawyer. Generally you're not liable unless you sign a guarantee of the payments. But there are states that allow creditors to collect from adult children under filial responsibility laws.There's also a statute of limitations for every claim - 5 years may be too late even if your state does have filial responsibility laws.
Bottom line, you need to see a lawyer. You don't want this mucking up your credit report, or be dealing with collection agencies.
On the radio...attorney Bill Handel advises: Do not confirm the debt.
You say this is from the nursing home? Not sure this will be helpful in your case, but I often receive bills (for labs or unknown doctors) for my husband. I forward copies of his insurance cards along with their bill, and never hear from them again. In your case, it would depend upon the NH arrangements with your mother's care, and if you helped with her fees there. Do you think payment was over-looked?
Sorry this is popping back up in your life after losing your mother. I would have a difficult time paying a bill for anyone deceased, let alone 5 years later.
Let them write it off, do not confirm the bill, I think they are too late.
Is this the very first you've heard of it? - that there was any outstanding account with this nursing home?
I'd give them a call and ask for an explanation. Do not say anything that implies that you agree that any money is due, or not unless it's an incredibly good explanation - and even then that doesn't mean you're liable. Tread carefully.
Not to contradict anyone else's advice, but you ABSOLUTELY must follow the Fair Debt Collections Practices Act. It establishes a variety of actions for responding to debts, including doing so in writing.
Google Fair Debt Collections Practices Act, and read the Act, but you can also check this post as a similar situation occurred to another poster. It's somewhat different, but the underlying issue is that you must follow the FDCPA requirements to challenge the debt. Ignoring it is the worst thing you could do.
In your written challenge, ask for a copy of the (alleged) judgment even if none is mentioned. Also ask for validation of the debt, as well as the questions CM suggests in her last paragraph. However, and much as I respect CM's advice, you do not call the agency.
Calls are recorded, and I've found in my experience that the recordings are altered. Years ago a debt collector I challenged clearly recorded the conversation but deleted some portions.
If you have trouble interpreting the FDCPA, just post back here.
If you fail to follow it specifically though and respond in writing within 30 days of receipt of the notice, denying validity of the debt, that's interpreted as acknowledgment of the debt's validity.
Excellent answer, GA, And have read the referenced post, also good answers there!
It is a peeve of mine when someone like the nursing home billing makes such an error, failing to follow up with the facts, then drops this puzzle on unsuspecting persons, forcing them to research what they could have done prior if they were doing their job right! I recently received a bill, called them up, and they said, what bill, how did you get that bill? It turned out the insurance had not yet paid when reception gave dH a receipt for his co-pay by copying the ledger. Nerves get raw. But we didn't owe anything.
Send, sometime ago I did some research on the seedy debt collection industry, including the reselling of uncollected debt. There are a few tiers of collection levels, resulting in an initial debt collector giving up and selling the debt to another collector. (Just when you thought it was safe to open the mail...!)
Sometimes there's quite an extensive time period between the first and second collectors coming after someone.
I think there's a statute of limitations on debt collection but don't remember what it is w/o checking the FDCPA.
I'm glad your research paid off and it was just a delay in reimbursement. I've experienced something like that a few times, or especially when someone codes improperly and the bill is rejected, and must be rebilled with the proper codes.
And then there's Medicare, with its convoluted and unfathomable reasons for rejecting legitimate procedures.
That's one job I don't think I could handle - all that Medicare coding is so specific, and sometimes barely understandable.
I think I'll try that, just for laughs, if I ever get any real live person solicitation calls. Most of them are robo calls so saying anything to them is fruitless.
Julia, I did a quick check on the statute of limitations for debt collection. It varies by state. Your state isn't listed in your profile, so I can't check that, but do google "debt collection statute of limitations."
What boggles my mind is that a nursing home would just now be attempting to collect a debt, after 5 years. Somebody's bookkeeping needs to be updated! Or maybe the facility changed hands and somebody's going over the books with a "fine toothed comb".
I agree with what GardenArtist said above about following the rules outlined in the Fair Debt Collections Practices Act to challenge a claimed debt. I also think it's worthwhile to check your state's statute of limitations and filial responsibility laws.
Just to clarify what I meant, no, don't call the collections agency! Call the NH - or that's what I'd do, anyway. And if the NH can't identify the debt I'd probably then ignore it.
By proceeding, I agree that I understand the following disclosures:
I. How We Work in Washington.
Based on your preferences, we provide you with information about one or more of our contracted senior living providers ("Participating Communities") and provide your Senior Living Care Information to Participating Communities. The Participating Communities may contact you directly regarding their services.
APFM does not endorse or recommend any provider. It is your sole responsibility to select the appropriate care for yourself or your loved one. We work with both you and the Participating Communities in your search. We do not permit our Advisors to have an ownership interest in Participating Communities.
II. How We Are Paid.
We do not charge you any fee – we are paid by the Participating Communities. Some Participating Communities pay us a percentage of the first month's standard rate for the rent and care services you select. We invoice these fees after the senior moves in.
III. When We Tour.
APFM tours certain Participating Communities in Washington (typically more in metropolitan areas than in rural areas.) During the 12 month period prior to December 31, 2017, we toured 86.2% of Participating Communities with capacity for 20 or more residents.
IV. No Obligation or Commitment.
You have no obligation to use or to continue to use our services. Because you pay no fee to us, you will never need to ask for a refund.
V. Complaints.
Please contact our Family Feedback Line at (866) 584-7340 or ConsumerFeedback@aplaceformom.com to report any complaint. Consumers have many avenues to address a dispute with any referral service company, including the right to file a complaint with the Attorney General's office at: Consumer Protection Division, 800 5th Avenue, Ste. 2000, Seattle, 98104 or 800-551-4636.
VI. No Waiver of Your Rights.
APFM does not (and may not) require or even ask consumers seeking senior housing or care services in Washington State to sign waivers of liability for losses of personal property or injury or to sign waivers of any rights established under law.
I agree that:
A.
I authorize A Place For Mom ("APFM") to collect certain personal and contact detail information, as well as relevant health care information about me or from me about the senior family member or relative I am assisting ("Senior Living Care Information").
B.
APFM may provide information to me electronically. My electronic signature on agreements and documents has the same effect as if I signed them in ink.
C.
APFM may send all communications to me electronically via e-mail or by access to an APFM web site.
D.
If I want a paper copy, I can print a copy of the Disclosures or download the Disclosures for my records.
E.
This E-Sign Acknowledgement and Authorization applies to these Disclosures and all future Disclosures related to APFM's services, unless I revoke my authorization. You may revoke this authorization in writing at any time (except where we have already disclosed information before receiving your revocation.) This authorization will expire after one year.
F.
You consent to APFM's reaching out to you using a phone system than can auto-dial numbers (we miss rotary phones, too!), but this consent is not required to use our service.
Bottom line, you need to see a lawyer. You don't want this mucking up your credit report, or be dealing with collection agencies.
You say this is from the nursing home?
Not sure this will be helpful in your case, but I often receive bills (for labs or unknown doctors) for my husband. I forward copies of his insurance cards along with their bill, and never hear from them again.
In your case, it would depend upon the NH arrangements with your mother's care, and if you helped with her fees there. Do you think payment was over-looked?
Sorry this is popping back up in your life after losing your mother.
I would have a difficult time paying a bill for anyone deceased, let alone 5 years later.
Let them write it off, do not confirm the bill, I think they are too late.
Mark "Return to Sender - Deceased 2009" and drop it in a mailbox
I'd give them a call and ask for an explanation. Do not say anything that implies that you agree that any money is due, or not unless it's an incredibly good explanation - and even then that doesn't mean you're liable. Tread carefully.
Google Fair Debt Collections Practices Act, and read the Act, but you can also check this post as a similar situation occurred to another poster. It's somewhat different, but the underlying issue is that you must follow the FDCPA requirements to challenge the debt. Ignoring it is the worst thing you could do.
https://www.agingcare.com/questions/collections-notice-nursing-facility-when-covered-by-medicare-is-this-a-scam-432083.htm
A slightly different situation is also addressed here:
https://www.agingcare.com/questions/what-to-do-collection-agency-calls-for-deceased-mother-202928.htm
In your written challenge, ask for a copy of the (alleged) judgment even if none is mentioned. Also ask for validation of the debt, as well as the questions CM suggests in her last paragraph. However, and much as I respect CM's advice, you do not call the agency.
Calls are recorded, and I've found in my experience that the recordings are altered. Years ago a debt collector I challenged clearly recorded the conversation but deleted some portions.
If you have trouble interpreting the FDCPA, just post back here.
If you fail to follow it specifically though and respond in writing within 30 days of receipt of the notice, denying validity of the debt, that's interpreted as acknowledgment of the debt's validity.
And have read the referenced post, also good answers there!
It is a peeve of mine when someone like the nursing home billing makes such an error, failing to follow up with the facts, then drops this puzzle on unsuspecting persons, forcing them to research what they could have done prior if they were doing their job right!
I recently received a bill, called them up, and they said, what bill, how did you get that bill? It turned out the insurance had not yet paid when reception gave dH a receipt for his co-pay by copying the ledger. Nerves get raw. But we didn't owe anything.
Do you think the bill is valid?
Or covered by insurance?
Sometimes there's quite an extensive time period between the first and second collectors coming after someone.
I think there's a statute of limitations on debt collection but don't remember what it is w/o checking the FDCPA.
I'm glad your research paid off and it was just a delay in reimbursement. I've experienced something like that a few times, or especially when someone codes improperly and the bill is rejected, and must be rebilled with the proper codes.
And then there's Medicare, with its convoluted and unfathomable reasons for rejecting legitimate procedures.
That's one job I don't think I could handle - all that Medicare coding is so specific, and sometimes barely understandable.
https://www.agingcare.com/questions/what-to-do-collection-agency-calls-for-deceased-mother-202928.htm
I think I'll try that, just for laughs, if I ever get any real live person solicitation calls. Most of them are robo calls so saying anything to them is fruitless.
What boggles my mind is that a nursing home would just now be attempting to collect a debt, after 5 years. Somebody's bookkeeping needs to be updated! Or maybe the facility changed hands and somebody's going over the books with a "fine toothed comb".