What can I do with a non-responsive sibling who is on the deed to mom's house too?
Mom passed away late last year, my nephew and his family were living in my mothers house to "take care of it" (i.e. Caretaker). It took over six months to get them out of her house, but now (I assume) they are living with my brother, his wife, her kids and his other child (eight others total). When I was finally able to inspect the house, they left tons of junk and three door frames now need repair because they have been sprung from forced entry. The neighbors indicate that they had lots of fights/arguments and are so glad that they are gone. Needless to say, my entire summer has been consumed with getting the property back up to its original condition so that it can be sold. Unfortunately I had to take six weeks off to recover from an injury I incurred while working on the house.
The major problem I now have is my sibling and his bad attitude. Seems he "likes to p*ss me off" per his wife and has done so by taking possessions that I had wanted and now has drained/closed the joint account that we both had with mom. These funds were being used to hire help (i.e. haul junk away, paint the entire interior of the house and contractors/handymen to fix damages). I have kept all receipts and records of when, where and who was paid for each job, now my brother has undermined me by taking the funds I had earmarked for finishing up the work, anticipating and planning with my realtor to place the home on "the market" in October.
Here is where my current problem lies. My brother is on the deed to the house with me (mom had a life estate & we are now the sole deed holders). He has done absolutely nothing to clean up or fix up the house. I have seen him "drive by" on occasion while I was there working, but he is non-responsive to anything I try to do to "reason with him" about this house. I have consulted with my attorney, spoke with the realtor and even had a conversation with his wife. When we were still on speaking terms he indicated to me that his doctor was ordering some additional tests because they suspected that he had "early onset Alzheimer's" (he's in his mid 50's) or some other neuro-degenerative disease. I really, really don't want to go to court about something that seems so logical. Is it possible that if he has been diagnosed with Alzheimer's or some other form of dementia that this unreasonable behavior is one of his symptoms? It seems that his anger is directed towards me, yet I am the one who took care of mom for her last ten years with us. I visited her, celebrated birthdays/mother's day etc. with her and although he lived closer to mom than I, he would not visit unless I asked him to come "celebrate" with us. I know that mom had difficulty remembering who he was, but how was that my fault? I really don't understand why he is being so vindictive towards me when all I want to do is release "US" from the responsibilities of keeping up another house and having a little extra cash in our bank accounts when everything is settled.
My attorney has advised me to have a conversation with my brother and explain to him that going to court is expensive and in the long run, both of us will lose a good chunk of the profits from the sale of the house to court costs and legal fees. This is the worst conundrum I have ever had to deal with and makes the ten years of taking care of mom fond memories. Oh how I wish mom & dad were here to help! Any suggestions are welcomed!!
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Family members are the WORST when it comes to this. My sister lived at Mom's for 10 yrs and never lifted a finger to keep house or maintain things like the sprinkler system. I'm doing the same samethings you are as I am Mom's guardian/conservator. The sad thing is technically the money comes out of her money, but I have a guilt complex about that so I pay ALOT out of pocket for now; I pay the bills from her money.
My step-siblings were all concerned when I became involved about whether Daddy would get the house (Mom's sole/separate property), her retirement accounts etc should Mom pass before Daddy. I thought that was very odd to start off with these questions. They are upset that it doesn't work that way in my home State as it is COMPLETELY COMMUNITY PROPERTY. Daddy only gets 50% of anything during the marriage, not before. He was an "authorized" signer on the account (I told Mom not to do it, let him have his own account), therefore he COULD NOT add anyone to the account....really pi**** off all of them. THREE BANKERS told her, BUT the last one after I told her to open an account for she and Daddy so I could transfer funds over, she had Daddy sign any inter office debit for $21.892.08 moved to the new account then told him how to setup on-line banking so SHE HAD THE ACCESS DENIED TO HER, moved $8.800 to the account for the 1st month rent to the assisted living group home I had to place both as well as having asked me for $2.200 from the get go. This last one, she told me the bank opened the account without a deposit (I'm retired retail banking officer...doesn't work that way, but I love my step-father and transferred anyway. There is more money she got thru Daddy's Alzheimer's and using her DPOA fraudulently. Now, every sibling step or blood cannot do ANYTHING WITHOUT MY PERMISSION!
The Judge asked me about the money issues and I said that anyone with half a brain should be able to read the entire notations on every transaction. I told him she put the money in a Trust as she signs all the docs as POA AND TRUSTEE now. This woman is a college GRADUATE in education, she's messing with the wrong person.
I hired an attorney whose practice is 75% Elderly Abuse Law. Notice to Appear have been filed and my step-sister will have alot of explaining to do in Court/on record! I am an interested party, so I can attend the hearing and OMG, I provided the attorney with COPIES OF ALL OF THE TRANSACTIONS relating to just the $30.000+ as well as emails I was copied to back the $21.8992.08!!
So, my very long answer to you is, DON'T TAKE THE WORD OF THE 1ST ATTORNEY YOU TALK WITH. Keep calling others, research their area of law % they do, find a paralegal who helps as a business on the side in this area, keep your records VERY DETAILED, hope you have pictures of the destruction, truly get a membership with on-line service like I did and lastly...RESEARCH EVERYTHING, EVERYONE UNTIL YOU FEEL LIKE YOU'RE GOING BLIND!
It felt really good taking step-sister's attorney, Court appointed Fiduciary for Mom AND the Judge to school in this matter. The best part, I had a GREAT paralegal helping me and I REPRESENTED MYSELF. I did all the leg work, that's tough, but I only had a $725 bill for the paralegal's work/help any time I needed her. I DID NOT HIRE MY ATTORNEY UNTIL AFTER I WAS APPOINTED BY THE COURT.
GO GET HIM GIRL!! YOU CAN DO THIS, I DIDN'T THINK I COULD AT FIRST, BUT THE MORE I LEARNED THE MORE CONFIDENCE I HAD IN MYSELF.
It's not a conundrum you're in, it's called you're up sh**'s creek without a paddle.
1. Get a different attorney
2. I say this all of the time on these posts but it helps SO MUCH that you can actually know more than the attorney!!
RESEARCH YOUR STATE LAWS!
a. Do you live in a Common Law State v Community Property
b. This is something people NEVER think about: RESEARCH SECRATARY OF STATE RULES AND REGULATIONS FOR ANY CHANGES IN THESE REQUIREMENTS!
My sister had Mom redo the beneficiary deed in Nov 2011 BUT new regulation(s) requirements became law in July 2011!! The NOTARY DID NOT COMPLETE THE NECESSARY DOCUMENTATION SO THE 2ND DEED IS INVALID! Research opinions of attorneys who deal with these issues. NOT every so called family or elderly law attorney truly understands the law....my step-sister's attorney tried to bully me, but didn't have a leg to stand on which I had so much fun watching her squirm at my Court hearing!!
c. TALK WITH A PARALEGAL WHO WORKS FOR AN ATTORNEY/HAS OWN BUSINESS HELPING PREP COURT DOCS ETC. THEY KNOW MORE THAN THE ATTORNEYS. JUST LIKE ON MEDICAL TV SHOWS, THE NURSES KNOW MORE THAN DRS (our daughter is an RN, my step-brother-in-law is Chief of ER as well as a Medicine Professor @ Large for Mich State....these shows depict exactly how it is in real life!)
d. Did you know that RNs are actually graded at the same standards as if they were in high school biology while Drs are a pass/fail grade system?
3. GET A MEMBERSHIP WITH AN ON-LINE WEBSITE LIKE JUSTANSWER.COM. Don't laugh, $49 a month I could ask as many questions as I needed, scan docs to them. You can request an attorney who works, knowledge of the laws in your State 24/7. LegalZoom.com isn't worth a tinker's da**. There was an advertisement on AgingCare and that's how I found Justanswer.com. I've had a membership for over 3 yrs and just like an exceptional paralegal, these attorneys have a plethora of help. They even helped me understand State Statutes etc
3. Request ALL current RECORDED docs from the State Recorder's office. It's going to cost money....I've spent $200+ on recording fees as well as copy fees. You'll need certified copies....these cost extra.
You can look at the documents on-line 1st as they are public records.
4. How was the beneficiary deed naming you 2? Mom would have only been on the deed. You/brother should have been on a beneficiary deed, otherwise both of you are like husband/wife if you're on the "deed".
Is there a quit claim deed involved? Your Mom would have been the ONLY signer/person on this doc
5. Did Mom leave a Will? If not, then EVERYTHING should have gone through Probate as she would have passed enstate meaning she did not leave any instructions as to how she wanted things done. Even IF she had one, it still goes to Probate for the Court to review as a Will is only the WISHES of the decedent.
6. Your brother is a player. Yes, people younger than 50 can suffer Alzheimer's, dementia or both. RESEARCH AND TALK WITH A SPECIALIST IN THIS AREA OF MEDICINE ABOUT WHAT YOUR BROTHER HAS TOLD YOU
7. IF the accounts were JOINT meaning any 1 of you had "rights" to the money, you're screwed and would need to take him to Court. IF Mom was the account holder and she gave both of FINANCIAL POA, you have a better case as POA stops immediately upon the person's passing. IF the 2 of you were "AUTHORIZED SIGNERS" the bank should have been notified about the death as well as in the case of POA.
IF these mitigating factors were not done, you have a better chance of a settlement for the money, especially since you have the records....cudos!
8. IF your brother allowed his family members to live in the house WITHOUT your permission as well as not charging rent, you can and most likely do have a case against your brother. He maybe a beneficiary, but it must be decided between the 2 of you as to who is living there (background checks), as well as a signed rental/lease agreement. This would have stated that upon leaving the
I would think that there could be legal ways around getting him to work with you and sign paperwork. Granted it will cost money to do that, but it will cost more to hand on to the place! As others suggested, hopefully you have kept good records on what was spent to fix it up (deductions!) and if you spend any money out of pocket, you should get that back at closing. However, you would HAVE to get this worked out before putting the house on the market. Usually if someone wants to buy, they have a set date for closing, and it usually is quick, so you won't have time to work it out then. Also, people buying won't want hassles to deal with for closing - so yes, get this dealt with asap.
As for him taking the funds from her account, the attorney can probably help there too. Yes, it belongs to you both after her death, but it should be equal. You, hopefully, have records to show how you used funds. If he doesn't, what he "took" should come off his share of the proceeds of the sale.
When my mother died over 20 years ago, I was executor of her trust and had to sell the house right away to pay off the over $70,000 in credit card debt (in 1997 dollars!) that she had accumulated as she paid for my brother's living expenses. The house had been allowed to become a disaster as she could not afford even minimal maintenance as she put her retirement money, too, toward helping him. (She was a complete enabler.) She would have been fine financially if it weren't for supporting him and his family.
So I sold the place ASAP and had to split the remaining proceeds with him 50/50. Was it fair? No. Did I have any legal recourse? No. The way I looked at it then is how I look at it now. If the house had burned to the ground and everything in it had been destroyed, I would not have gotten a thing. So anything I got out of it was better than nothing. "The Lord gives and the Lord takes away. Blessed be the name of the Lord." That's all you can do.
Do not back down. Most of these cases are settled along the way. Your siblings will be forced to respond and either accept an offer from you for their undevided interest, or as you said, lose a lot of the value to court costs. The court will either divide the property— splitting it geographically or sell to highest bidder.
Either way, you will be rid of this low-life relationship.
I hope you took pics/videos of all the damage he did.
Your brother might feel you saddled him with another family. I dunno if that is the case. But it would explain the increasing hostility. Maybe he is paying for a second family. That could be why brother took the money? I'm sure nephew is whining to him.
I wouldn't kill myself working on a home that he's going to get half. Not when he can't lift a finger to fix it. I'd sell as a flipper or as is.
How can you sell a house if he is on the deed? Can he refuse to sign once sold? Not sure how that works. I'd send an email stating your not fixing it. Fixing it costs $ and your time. Your not getting paid, just injured physically and mentally. Perhaps brother thinks your fixing it for free to get more of the proceeds? Who knows.
You could try to take the nephew to court. I'm sure he could be made to pay for trashing it, if you have proof. That will sever all ties with your brother permanently. He's going to take the sons side.
What if you said he has to go to every meeting with the realtor? Why should you do all the legwork selling it? I bet if you said your not paying the taxes and let it go he would step up.
I'd tell him he can't have it both ways. Be hostile and not lift a finger to fix it, but wants a payout after you fix it up to get more money.
Can you talk to the wife without the brother, or will she be hostile too? Maybe an email will be better than face to face?
My brother has admitted to others that he intentionally took some of moms possessions that he knew I wanted "just to P*ss me off" and has put some of them in storage (other items he took to the dump or sold in a garage sale). Any emails that he has sent to me are full of profanity and false accusations. I really don't know this person anymore! My mother loved her house and the state that my nephew left it in is beyond deplorable.
I can't just walk away. As I said before, I have spent this entire summer working on this house. The junk is gone, the interior walls are freshly washed and painted (after repairing the numerous holes) and most of the hardwood floors have been cleaned and refreshed. I plan to see my attorney this week to begin whatever action is necessary. Wish me Luck!
You should NOT spend your personal money on the house or property because you may not be able to get your money back at the time of sell because you did not have your brothers written permission to do so even if you have all the receipts. Always protect yourself personally and financially.
I am so sorry you are having such a hard time with your brother. Sometimes a death of a parent does bring out feelings & anger of siblings that we often cannot explain or understand. Just try to remember all the good times you had with your Mom and know you did what was good for her. You may never be able to resolve this problem with your brother and you may watch the house fall apart but he still won't agree to sell. At some point you may have to simply walk away.
I wish you well with your brother & the house.
If by chance the house had already been deeded over to you and brother with no one else on the deed, if it is 50/50 you still won’t be able to sell without his cooperation. You will then have to “sue “ him in Court to ask for a forced sale based on your lopsided financial burdens for the house.
Either way, DO NOT put another penny in the house. It might be all for naught.
One other possible option , if you and your brother are the only people on the Deed, is to pay for a professional Market Value Appraisal and then make a formal, offer , in writing, to your brother to buy his half out.
All of the above require legal services by an experienced Probate Law attorney.
I agree with the advice to sell the home as is. We went through this a couple of years ago and the extra money you may (or may not) get isn't worth the hassle of renovations that the new owner may not even want. You can sell the home with broken door jambs. Take the possessions you want, call someone to empty out the rest and put it on the market.
You did well well taking care of your Mom. You will have always have the satisfaction of knowing how great you cared for her and during that time you also included your brother which is an axtra kudo to you. It is time for you to pamper yourself now! Good luck!
Minimize face-to-face or telephone conversations - primarily use text or email. This will allow you to keep a "paper trail" that might be needed later in legal proceedings and also reduces the level of drama. In all correspondence be sure to document your invitation for your brother to act logically and rationally - clearly describe/suggest what that behavior looks like as this will give him a noble reputation to live up to. As decisions are made, it will be clear for other parties to see who is being reasonable and rational. Even if your brother is struggling to think clearly or make rational/logical/responsible decisions - you have no other option but to wade through these muddy waters for a time. There is a chance that he might be influenced by your courage and grace. Either way, it will help you keep your sanity along the way.
i hate her more that I’ve ever thought I could hate anyone, this aunt is 72 years old never cared or participated in any care for our uncles as she lived is the USA, greed narcissism, waited on him dying, so she could swoop in and take all.
I lost my home in Scotland as I had no moeny to pay her, we had receipts for ever thing we bought and paid for. So I say POA is not worth a penny and if you have a greedy narcissistic aunt that wanted it all this is what narcissist do, and I’m talking about 600k that she ended up with but that wasn’t enough for her. I hate her and have to believe in Karma, May she rot in hell, and her 2 daughters.
So, what to do? I really hate to spend the money to go to court to force his hand on selling moms/our house and with winter coming I suppose I could use that time to finish fixing the place up so that it is better than ever. I'm in Michigan.......does anyone out there know how much taking my brother to court will cost??
I was charged for every phone call, email, question, postage, filing court records.
I now understand how that works, $2030.00 later, and it is still not closed.
My brother is more than a decade older than me with a higher IQ during school years but like many gifted students didn't consistently make good grades - report cards filled with As-Ds in any one term. I also had inconsistent grades in elementary school but never worse than one C in any one term. By middle school I developed enough discipline to make the straight As. Dad never made a big deal of our grades as long as they were at least Cs. I didn't get anymore praise for the straight A reporting periods than for the ones with Bs and a C. Dad did get on my brother when he made Ds and Fs and limited some of his privileges until his grades improved, like a boy scout trip. My brother also got into some trouble for minor misbehavior/pranks at school. Because I had good grades and didn't get into any trouble I was allowed to do just about anything I wanted - played sports, went on church youth and school trips, etc. I was so much younger I asked brother #2 and some cousins if our parents were tougher on brother #1 than other parents were being a their kids with similar issues - no one seems to think so.
Brother #2 told me a I shouldn't listen to much brother #1 has to say because he cooked his brain on some of the drugs he took in his 20s (during the 70s). I'm not sure how much of that is valid but I do think he has some long standing mental/emotional problems. I can see how he has some justification for thinking our parents treated me "so different" but I don't understand (1) how that could be _my_ fault, our parents were the decision makers; and (2) how he doesn't accept any responsibility for the impact his own behavior/choices make on our parents' decisions. Brother #2 is just 14 months younger than brother #1; he also got to play sports because he always had decent grades too. But brother #1 is not angry about brother #2 having privileges he didn't - just me.
Like your experience, this bitterness really came out and impacted care giving for our parents. I'm expecting it to make a mess with settling any estate too. I have reluctantly come to the conclusion that I cannot really understand my brother's feelings and reasoning. I accept it's a problem that has no solution. I try to limit our contact as much as possible so to not aggravate his anger, use defensive measures to protect myself and our parents only where really needed, and to be as courteous and kind as I can possibly be when we do interact.
I was #2 child, actually was the first birthday present for #1. #3 was much younger than me. While growing up, I was the target of his (#1) physical and verbal abuse. As we got older, this diminished some as we were doing our own things with our own friends. After college, marriage, etc, we were never really "together" - living far apart, get together once in a while for family gathering, etc. So, this nasty behavior was apparently "gone".
Fast forward to getting mom into a safe place and cleaning out the condo to rent/sell. He came up to help a few times in 2 years, staying for 1-2 weeks (bulk of the work, excluding moving furniture, really fell on me, plus being primary contact, doctor appointments, most visits, SS, pension, finances, trust, coordinating major repairs needed, etc fell on my plate.) Sometimes he became a bit testy during these "trips", but I (unfortunately) chalked it up to stress, trying to get more done than we had time for, etc. His last "visit" to help was in May. The plan was to stay at my place for the 2 weeks and we would work on clean up/fix up together. He could visit mom as well during down time, as condo was a hike, mom is 15 min away. He lasted from Sunday afternoon to Friday evening. He got mad as hell over stupid things (an hour or day later it was like it never happened when these "incidents" occurred.) That evening he crossed the room and threw me to the floor, twice, bruising my ankle badly and hurting my leg. I told him to get the F out of my house and he will NEVER be welcome back! During his time "packing" he kept coming back and throwing verbal insults at me. He showed up with stuff from mom's place Mon, Tues and Wed, but I refused to acknowledge he was there or let him in. He'd sit out there, no call, no text, just sit out there for an hour+ and then leave the stuff. Sure, I'm going to welcome THAT back in... NOPE!
I realize now this is WHO HE IS and ALWAYS has been. I did check with his daughter, to find out what the deal was with his first divorce (we heard almost nothing - sounds like maybe this is what happened then too! We will never know as sadly she passed away after some surgery many years later.) However, his daughter told me that he's done similar to her, even as a late teen and young adult! I was aware of how he treated her as a child when they or we were visiting (5yo, his tone of voice AND what he said to her was totally inappropriate - I suspect she grew up with this crap all the time!)
So consider your brother is who he is, tread lightly around him (if you really have to be around him), or do like I did - no contact. Forget the high IQ business - it really means very little... Ted Kaczynski (unabomber) was considered some kind of genius, yet what did that get him? People can be all kinds of "smart" but not have a clue or waste their talents just floating along on that "smartness"! Although drugs could play a role, it sounds like this predates the possible drug years.
FWIW I actually spent some time looking up sibling abuse after the incident in May. Not rivalry, ABUSE! It is a real thing, and although they say it has not really been studied as well as it should, they indicate that sibling abuse is more rampant than any other abuse! The problem is too many people (parents included) chalk it up to sibling rivalry or "boys being boys"... The behavior is typically not evident when parents are around, so they tend not to put much credence in anything reported by a child. That does NOT explain someone who drives a fist into a sleeping sibling's stomach in the middle of the night, does it?
No, do not second guess yourself about him. HE is the problem. Keep on with that limited contact or better yet NO contact. In our case, he lives 2 days drive away, is not likely to visit mom again (while here he went twice and refused to go again because "he didn't know what to do with her."), so it is not like he'd come here to see her!
My brother is younger, and sat on important paperwork that he had to sign as Dad's POA since February. There was a March deadline for the paperwork to be completed without huge ($100K plus) penalties. He signed it on Labour Day weekend. He will be covering the penalties and interest out of his share of the estate when it is finally settled. I will not be out of pocket because he was unwilling to do his job.